Israel 'Apartheid' ?

Question

What do we all think?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/mar/04/israel-palestinians-only-bus

Answer 1

Is Israel apartheid? The question you should really ask first is WHAT IS "apartheid"?

a Denial to a member or members of a racial group or groups of the right to life and liberty of person

By murder of members of a racial group or groups;

By the infliction upon the members of a racial group or groups of serious bodily or mental harm, by the infringement of their freedom or dignity, or by subjecting them to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment;

By arbitrary arrest and illegal imprisonment of the members of a racial group or groups;

Deliberate imposition on a racial group or groups of living conditions calculated to cause its or their physical destruction in whole or in part;

Any legislative measures and other measures calculated to prevent a racial group or groups from participation in the political, social, economic and cultural life of the country and the deliberate creation of conditions preventing the full development of such a group or groups, in particular by denying to members of a racial group or groups basic human rights and freedoms, including the right to work, the right to form recognised trade unions, the right to education, the right to leave and to return to their country, the right to a nationality, the right to freedom of movement and residence, the right to freedom of opinion and expression, and the right to freedom of peaceful assembly and association;

Any measures including legislative measures, designed to divide the population along racial lines by the creation of separate reserves and ghettos for the members of a racial group or groups, the prohibition of mixed marriages among members of various racial groups, the expropriation of landed property belonging to a racial group or groups or to members thereof;

Exploitation of the labour of the members of a racial group or groups, in particular by submitting them to forced labour;

Persecution of organizations and persons, by depriving them of fundamental rights and freedoms, because they oppose apartheid.



Note this also includes areas under a states control, ie occupation.

It's very simple- if Israel does these thing- it is an apartheid state.

Answer 2

I don't think, but know, that the Apartheid analogy is BS.



I mean, in Israel proper, it simply doesn't hold. Israeli citizens who are Arab have every single right that a Jewish Israeli has. The law doesn't make distinctions there, and I've personally seen how the two can get along well without troubles. Sure, the situation isn't perfect, but the flaws that the two have in relations do not define Apartheid, or else a whole lot of the world would be characterized by that word.



As for the bus system, I think it should be noted that anyone can take the buses. I mean the ones that the settlers use, and the ones that were instituted for Palestinians specifically. There seems to be no law that suggests that one can't take the other; however, it is the laws of the people and society itself that is a bit limiting here. Still, that's not legal Apartheid, and the piece does suggest that Palestinians do ride on the same buses as settlers, or else why would a complaint be made?



They are meant for the Palestinians, since no one lives in the village that isn't. Not Jews, anyway, and I'd argue that a Jew riding in this bus would feel very threatened. I'm not going to argue that the inverse isn't true, either. From what I understand of Palestinians, anyway, I'm sure they prefer not to ride with the settlers. I'd also highlight that, despite tension, that Israel is still shelling out money for this, pointing out that they still allow a non-national group, sometimes characterized by hostility, into their nation. I think that what people are missing is that they are still working with the Palestinians, whereas other peoples would've stopped.

Answer 3

Apartheid isn't notably lots discrimination. it extremely is a controversy of international regulation. Apartheid regimes codify into their relatives regulations 3 pillars of apartheid: one million. The state adopts a wide-unfold identification, then establishes regulations granting preferential prestige and privileges to the well-liked team. 2. The state segregates the inhabitants into geographic areas consistent with identification. the well-liked identification gets preferential get admission to to land, water and different substances and advantages. The non-favourite team is constrained to ever-shrinking, non-contiguous besieged enclaves. 3. The state passes protection regulations to suppress all opposition. those opposing apartheid are categorised terrorists. Domination is enforced by way of assassinations, imprisonment (many times for years), torture and vicious, inhumane, degrading scientific care. using those standards, a international legal team subsidized via the Human Sciences learn Council of South Africa those days achieved a learn that concluded that Israel's practices against Palestinians attain the point of apartheid as measured via international regulation. "and don't say something approximately Palestine, because of the fact Palestine is below the government of Hamas, no longer Israel," Israel has effective administration over Palestinian territories. in spite of the actuality that the Palestinians interior the West financial business enterprise and Gaza now govern themselves, they at the instant are not an self sufficient us of a. they're nonetheless technically area of Israel. The Economist, in an editorial on the communicate over withdrawal from the West financial business enterprise and Gaza Strip ("Israel's settlers: waiting for a miracle", The Economist, August 11, 2005), asserted that "preserving the occupied land will stress on Israel the impossible determination of being the two an apartheid state, or a binational one with Jews as a minority."[

Answer 4

Thanks. You have just strengthened out arguments. Notice how they're only creating these Palestinian-only buses for the interests of Israeli settlers. They couldn't care less for Palestinians. The buses are probably cardboard boxes for all we know. Also, the very fact that they can launch a Palestinian only bus is Apartheid in itself. You say "Palestinian-only" but what this really means is "Israeli-only". Palestinians get old boxes that are about to fall apart as their form of transport. This is South Africa or the U.S. all over again.



You have just made a fool out of yourself by posting those two links. Congratulations.

Answer 5

They really Distorted it, "Palestinian only" because it's coming straight from the west bank to Tel Aviv...

Calling Israel an Apartheid is really stupid when there are Arabs in the Knesset (Israeli Parliament), Arabs have more rights than Jews and that they don't even have to join the army.

Answer 6

Are you also one of those how blame women for being raped?



Others here gave good answers refuting your "Apartheid" claim. Let me add some details you failed to glean from that article:



Israel provides work to tens of thousands of Palestinians.



Israel could have easily pretended that it had "sunk into the sea", as the Arabs have always wished, but, no, it chooses to help the Palestinians --effectively residents of a foreign country-- by providing them with jobs.



The opposite isn't true: Zero Israelis work inside Palestinian areas. They'll be butchered there.



BTW, in the 80s Palestinians could enter Israel almost freely. No roadblocks. 60% percent of the working Palestinians in Gaza had their jobs in Israel. But then violent elements among the Palestinians prevailed, and everything changed.

Answer 7

From Simon Deng former Sudanese slave (edited as it was a little too long) :



I want to thank the organizers of this conference, The Perils of Global Intolerance. It is a great honor for me and it is a privilege really to be among today’s distinguished speakers.



I came here as a friend of the State of Israel and the Jewish people. –I came to protest this Durban conference which is based on a set of lies. It is organized by nations who are themselves are guilty of the worst kinds of oppression.

In the Nuba Mountains, another region of Sudan, genocide is taking place as I speak. The Islamist regime in Khartoum is targeting the black Africans – Muslims and Christians.







As a former slave and a victim of the worst sort of racism, allow me to explain why I think calling Israel a racist state is absolutely absurd and immoral.



I have been to Israel five times visiting the Sudanese refugees. Let me tell you how they ended up there. These are Sudanese who fled Arab racism, hoping to find shelter in Egypt. They were wrong. When Egyptian security forces slaughtered twenty-six black refugees in Cairo who were protesting Egyptian racism, the Sudanese realized that the Arab racism is the same in Khartoum or Cairo. They needed shelter and they found it in Israel. Dodging the bullets of the Egyptian border patrols and walking for very long distances, the refugees’ only hope was to reach Israel’s side of the fence, where they knew they would be safe.



Black Muslims from Darfur chose Israel above all the other Arab-Muslim states of the area. Do you know what this means!!!?? And the Arabs say Israel is racist!!!?



In Israel, black Sudanese, Christian and Muslim were welcomed and treated like human beings. Just go and ask them, like I have done. They told me that compared to the situation in Egypt, Israel is “heaven.”



Is Israel a racist state? To my people, the people who know racism – the answer is absolutely not. Israel is a state of people who are the colors of the rainbow. Jews themselves come in all colors, even black. I met with Ethiopian Jews in Israel. Beautiful black Jews.



So, yes … I came here today to tell you that the people who suffer most from the UN anti-Israel policy are not the Israelis but all those people who the UN ignores in order to tell its big lie against Israel: we, the victims of Arab/Muslim abuse: women, ethnic minorities, religious minorities, homosexuals, in the Arab/Muslim world. These are the biggest victims of UN Israel hatred.





In 2005, I visited one of the refugee camps in South Sudan. I met a twelve-year-old girl who told me about her dream. In a dream she wanted to go to school to become a doctor. And then, she wanted to visit Israel. I was shocked. How could this refugee girl who spent most of her life in the North know about Israel? When I asked why she wanted to visit Israel, she said: “This is our people.” I was never able to find an answer to my question.





As a friend of Israel, I bring you the news that my President, the President of the Republic of South Sudan, Salva Kiir — publicly stated that the South Sudan embassy in Israel will be built— not in Tel Aviv, but in Jerusalem, the eternal capital of the Jewish people.



I also want to assure you that my own new nation, and all of its peoples, will oppose racist forums like the Durban III. We will oppose it by simply telling the truth. Our truth.



My Jewish friends taught me something I now want to say with you.



AM Y’ISRAEL CHAI!



The people of Israel lives!



Thank you"

Answer 8

Isnt it funny how everytime there is a link to an story bad mouthing Israel you will find a link to either The Guardian, Press TV or Mondoweiss.



Heres the real facts:



1:The Transport Ministry said the two new lines would "improve public transport services for Palestinian workers entering Israel" and replace pirate buses charging them "exorbitant prices".



Apparently palestinians have been getting ripped off from pirate bus services. So this new bus service is helping them save money.



2:"The Ministry of Transport has not issued any instruction or prohibition that prevents Palestinian workers from traveling on public transport in Israel nor in Judea and Samaria,"



Palestinians are still free to travel on the same buses as Jews in both Israel and Judea and Samaria (West Bank)



3:"Furthermore, the Ministry of Transport is not authorized to prevent any passenger from using public transport services."



In other words there is NO rule segregating palestinians or anyone else from using any public transport that they wish to use. (I guess that blows the Apartheid claim out of the water)



4: Herzl Ben-Zvi, mayor of the Karnei Shomron settlement, said the new lines "answer the needs of all passengers - Palestinians and settlers" because they would relieve overcrowding on buses in the area.



Apparently overcrowding on buses has been a problem. So this new line caters to everyones comfort and needs.



So in light of all this we can conclude that The Guardian is just doing what it does best, twisting stories to demonize Israel. Its a pathetic newspaper that isnt even fit to be used as toilet tissue.

Answer 9

I don't get it.



it says Israel will provide bus ferry services to Palestinians who work in Israel.

those buses are obviously "Palestinians only" since ... no Israelis live there (in Qalqiliya) ?



oh - wait,

do you mean Apartheid in the sense that no Jews are allowed on ?



"Officially anyone can use them" is just another Jewish lie against ... hmmm ... the Jews !?



by the way - permits (in the form of green id card) are granted by the ministry of internal affairs, not the army

Answer 10

The funny thing is that people think that Palestinian workers are ejected from "normal" buses and suddenly forced to use these new lines.



If you read the article:

"The new lines will replace irregular, pirate lines that charge very high prices from Palestinian passengers."

Answer 11

There is no genocide or Apartheid in Israel,what i have said is the truth

Answer 12

Interesting article, thanks for providing the link.



It reminded me of Europe in WWII when the German government provided special railway cars and even special trains dedicated to transport certain ethnic minorities to work destinations.



No one has ever accused the WWII German government of Apartheid.